Comments on: Thing That Will Make You Go Hmmm…

By: michael

michael — Tue, 25 Apr 2006 15:31:54 +0000

Interestingly enough, he admitted during his confession that he had on more than one occasion slapped his wife around, and he was angry at her for taking an evening job at a clothing store.

By: mobius

mobius — Tue, 25 Apr 2006 14:38:37 +0000

er, his story

By: mobius

mobius — Tue, 25 Apr 2006 14:37:37 +0000

Oh please, William Randolph Hearst is a fine publisher. Everyone else is just as yellow as him.

…

Um, has anyone considered the possibility that Valis may have been abusive towards his wife and that she’s corroborating her story out of fear?

By: themiddle

themiddle — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 21:53:06 +0000

Oh please, the J Post is a fine paper. Ynet and Ha’aretz told the exact same story.

By: grandmuffti

grandmuffti — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 21:30:12 +0000

Rabbi Yonah, the writers of this site frequently take articles and rewrite them with more snark. Muffti didn’t want to feel left out so he does it to. And then hopefully people will correct, discuss and in teh way that truth tends to come out of conversation by many, truth emerges. So Muffti feels happy enough posting stuff even from papers that you and Michael don’t like, especialy since he responsibly gives you a source for the data.

By: grandmuffti

grandmuffti — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 20:57:11 +0000

CK, Muffti isn’t saying that he is guilty. But he finds the reasoning allegedly employed by the rabbis to be extremely dubious. Thassall. As for bail, you would know the rulez better than Muffti but Muffti thought that heinousness of crime IS a relevant factor in granting bail. That and danger to the community, etc. Anyhow, Muffti is in no way against the golden whatever thread of innocent until proven guilty.

By: Chutzpah

Chutzpah — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 19:44:17 +0000

Wives are not legitimate witnesses in Bais Din…why all of a sudden trust the weaker sex?

By: Chutzpah

Chutzpah — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 19:42:41 +0000

This happens in Haradi Communities in the U.S. as well. Because religious beliefs prohibit autopsy, the Coroner’s office needs overwhelming evidence to perform one to prove abuse or “Shaken Baby Syndrome”. Usually it is declared “Sudden Infant Death” and dismissed. During my divorce I personally witnessed members of a Chasidic community protesting in the State Court house in Paterson with signs that said “put the baby in the ground”.

By: Rabbi Yonah

Rabbi Yonah — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 15:29:10 +0000

GM didn’t you read Michael? It’s asur to read the JP. Its one of the many places that Michael and I agree. the JP is not a reliable source of information. It does seem from all reports that this father abused his son, but that the Rabbis declared him innocent…

This comment was left on the JP:

Saul Mashbaum – Israel
04/24/2006 09:29
The Post got it right Monday, when it reported that the rabbis called for the public to help the accused try to prove his innocence, without themselves commenting whether he is innocent or not. This article, however, is scandalously, almost libelously, inaccurate. The “JPOST.COM staff” who clumsily slapped together this defamatory article, attributing to the rabbis a position they did not take, should be ashamed of themselves.

But I do find it amusing that someone of your caliber of scholarship will make conclusions based on information in a fifth-rate newspaper without any access to primary documents.

By: ck

ck — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 14:56:48 +0000

Hey Muffti – Yeah, benefit of the doubt to anyone and everyone – innocent till proven guilty. They call that the golden thread that runs across the entire body of criminal law. Now, while i am extremely skeptical of the defendant’s innocence, stranger things have happenned. So as far as I am concerned, until a Judge declares him guilty, he remains, in fact, innocent. The sort of crime he is accused of is domestic. There is no evidence that he has ever been violent towards anyone in public and he has no other children. By any measure, despite the heinousness of the crime he is accused of, he ought to be released on bail. The only other considerations are whether or not he is a flight or suicide risk.

That having been said, anyone is free to advocate on his behalf. But those twits who rioted and burnt shit? There’s no exxcuse for that. I can’t believe the police did not manage to arrest anyone for that. Also, calling this accusation a “blood libel” is an insult to all the Jewish victims of such accusations. For shame!

By: grandmuffti

grandmuffti — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 14:34:48 +0000

Benefit of the doubt to people who think that guilt shouold be determined on the basis of whether or not a wife sticks by her husband? Puh-lease! Thank you Laya for making the obvious point. Muffti doesn’t think we should convict the guy wihtout trial; but he’s a little leery of people who absolve him on the basis of incredibly dubious evidence.

Nonetheless, Muffti had a suggestion: if they are so convinced he is innocent, the police should release him on bail and the rabbis should be forced to have him baby sit their kids. Let’s test some faith in halacha, shall we?

By: laya

laya — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 10:25:04 +0000

right, and what about the facts on the 3 week old child’s body? Like bite marks, just for instance.

By: yikes

yikes — Mon, 24 Apr 2006 07:32:00 +0000

you omit facts

a) wife says hubby never hurt kid
b) husband retracted confession, implying it was forced, under duress or whatever
c) several respected rabbanim have gotten involved – not bored misguided youth who do stupid things – so give them the benefit of the doubt and see how the case turns out

By: michael

michael — Sun, 23 Apr 2006 17:33:21 +0000

And Joe Schmo will shit his pants out of pique in 5…4…3…

But I’m glad, at least, that contrary to the claims of secular and non-Orthodox detractors, halakhah is actually not frozen in time! Hooray for a vital, adaptative Judaism! Now if only we could get a little less stupid…