I agree that the bulk of Jewish learning has to come from the parents. I love the families I see in my shul with kids who love their judaism, who continue to chant torah after their bar/bat mitzvot. Then I visit their homes and I see why. The homes are fantastically Jewish. Judaica, books, mezuzot (yep, in lots of the reform households we have ‘em.)

I wish all adult jews could go through the learning I went through leading up to my conversion. I learned at 27 what everyone else (typically) stopped learning at 13. I have an adult relationship to judaism as an adult and they have a child’s relationship to judaism as an adult. My born Jewish friends jokingly, but not so much joking, that they won’t send their kids to Hebrew school but to study with me.

I think the key is “Do that you might learn” and not the other way around. Just do Jewish and eventually, you’ll (the kids) learn Jewish.

(Um, so, this is me agreeing with JM in case that was confusing.)

Trying to replace an institution is no joke. But some people may still do that, for their own reasons. Who has thirty grand a year?

It is beyond belief what you can teach children at home, especially by not teaching, but just by talking, doing, putting up imagery on the walls at their eye level, and above all, “LEAVE IT LYING AROUND”.

A print-rich environment, with stuff left strategically lying around: the child picks up whatever reading material catches his eye, and you say, later, oh, is that intersting? Then you let him teach YOU with shining eyes, while you say, blank faced, Really! Oh. Hmm.

They learn best that way, when they don’t even know they are learning. Stay out of the way!

Oh, raising kids is so much fun…..

I did not mean to be elitist. We must wiggle the best we can. Everybody is terribly poor today and does not know it or want to admit it. That is terrible.

A household with one overworked man and a domestic woman has a higher gross income than the same people both employed. Why? Because when they are both working, he doesn’t work til he drops, and she needs to look nice, and get to work. Clothes and transportation. And, they order food in because she is too tired to cook.

Look at the immigrants from poor countries … they buy a house in five years. And that is how they live. The woman as moral/cultural/educational base camp was and still is a very real thing. The lack of that is huge. Her salary does not bring it back.

THAT may be the hidden reason why school costs thirty grand a year. That is what she was worth, when she was home.

Did I say life was perfect? We are not in the Garden of Eden.

That said, I have to respond to this.

CK said: I’m not opposed to Conservative day schools. I just think they need to do a better job educating their charges. I mean how do you go through any Jewish Day School and not know what Massada is? Or what a mikvah is? Or teffilin? Or even the most basic rudimentary facts of Jewish history? I agree that if this is true, this is appalling. But I doubt very much that it is true of Conservative Day Schools. Once or twice a week Hebrew schools–Orthodox, Conservative or Reform–are inherently flawed as a system, but if a child is going to Solomon Schechter, I assure you that he or she knows what tefillin is, what happened at Masada and what a mikvah is. S/he might not know all the Talmudic discussion of niddah, but I would say most Orthodox day school grads don’t know (or don’t retain) that info, either. To generalize about what Conservative schools do or don’t teach without experiencing it is ignorant. No offense.

However, as I said yesterday, good intentions do not a Jew from a non-Jew make. I hope that clarifies for once and for all that I am not referring to the personalities of any persons involved.

As for Chilul Hashem, any false conversion, whether performed in an orthodox managed mikveh or in one similarly owned by non-orthodox Jews or in a river, for that matter, are all Chilulei Hashem.

I love my fellow Jews – all of them – but I will defend the Torah from those that defile it. In matter that blatantly go against the Torah, such as the heresy of the reform and conservative movements, I will not hesitate to point it out.

While there are no nice words to say about deviations from Judaism (other than pity, shame, etc.), there’s plenty of wondeful things to say about all Jews, and plenty of non-Jews, for that matter.

I would love for nothing more than the unity of us all. That is how we encamped at Har Sinai, Keh’Ish Echad B’lev Echad, like one person with one heart, on these very days before receiving the Torah at Har Sinai over 3000 years ago.

Some of us Jews have clung to G-d’s commandments to us at that time through thick and thin. Only 200 and 100 years ago, did a group of first class heretics tear our nation apart, with disasterous consequences.

I’ve already mentioned that almost everybody today who have followed these heretical movements most likely have a din of a “tinok-shenishba”. At least I sure hope so. I sincerely feel sorry for them all. There is no sin’at chinam here for any person on my part. There is sinah betzedek for the sects that have led them astray.

If I were a blog author, the last thing I would like to deal with are such topics. But if someone else begins to delegitimize Judaism, I will respond.

For the record, there’s tons wrong with the orthodox Jewish world, from Israel’s political parties to this and that rabbi’s personal scandals.

I would gladly participate in constructive criticism of such matters for the bettrement of Judaism but not when the goals of those that join in the chorus is to destroy authentic Judaism to justify their own deviations.

Must be going – to the mikveh actually – Erev Yom Tov.

Yitamu Chata’im Min Ha’aretz U’reshaim Od Einam, Barchee Nafshee Et Hashem Haleluya. “Chata’im” velo “Chot’im”, said Chazal. That day will yet come. May it be in our lifetime.

Are you trying to engage people you disagree with in productive dialogue or are you simply out to bash anyone that disagrees with you? Which way do you feel the Torah would have you go? Which way best represents the values of derech eretz? or veahvta lreacha kamocha? Or ahavat chinam? How are we ever going to rebuild beit hamikdash with attitudes like that? I don’t mean to sound harsh but perhaps you may want to consider that over the holiday. Chag Sameach!

EV – please note, the standards I mentioned were Conservative standards hence not syllogistic. Conservative Judaism requires a certain measure of kashrut, does not encourage mixed marriages, requires the maintenance of family purity laws, believes in patrilineal descent etc. Those are Conservative values. Conservative Judaism claims to be halachic, so I’m just calling a spade a spade.

I’m not opposed to Conservative day schools. I just think they need to do a better job educating their charges. I mean how do you go through any Jewish Day School and not know what Massada is? Or what a mikvah is? Or teffilin? Or even the most basic rudimentary facts of Jewish history?

Boomer – my quote wasn’t meant to deride anyone. It represented a concise statement by a leading Conservative Rabbi on the state of immersion in Conservative Judaism. That the vast bulk of Conservative Jews rarely if ever make use of a mikveh is simply a statement of fact. As for circumcision, I never mentioned anything relating to that but for the record most Conservative and Reform Rabbis support circumcision with a small percentage of Reform rabbis allowing for an alternative Brit Shalom ceremony for those Jews who do not wish to circumcise their sons.

As for my attitude towards secular Jews, well, my many “secular” friends and acquaintances will tell you that I am many things, but xenophobic and exclusionary are not terms that will come up. I never pussyfoot about my opinions but I respect everyone.

There is no reason for these deviant movements. Most of the people I know have no problem finding deviation on their own.

I was taught in my music education that we interpret the same piece of music differently, according to our own interpretation. But the score remains the same.

This made sense to me in religion as well.

But then I would be handed a siddur with all these cheesy new edits, and told that it was now a good thing to daven differently– in an egalitarian setting, with upbeat new blessings, etc.

I found it disrespectful, disrespectful in a terminally boring way. I still do. It amazes me anyone finds that stuff compelling. And sure enough –most don’t. Not very. They get their kid bar/bat mitzvahed, and that’s it til the next lifecycle event.

Where is the gain promised to so many? Of greater affinity for Judaism with all these changes?

Nowhere. Not for most. There is no gain. Only loss.

So bring in the guitars. Bring in the change. Bring in the inclusion.

And then fool yourselves that the little chevra there on a Friday night is the norm, and signals something much larger than what it really is, particularly when you eliminate all the families preparing for their kid’s bar/bat mitzvah.

Judaism is about inner struggle. When it instead becomes a springboard for integration of the dominant secular culture with a solution oriented approach to eliminate the friction, there is no reason to continue. Some call it progress, but it is surrender. And surrender is not the most compelling of legacies. Not when you are a small minority.

Baptising Christians in a mikvah also doesn’t “treyf” up the mikveh.

Irregardless of whether my comparison is accurate or not, either case of such intentional misuse of a mikveh is a Chilul Hashem – a desecration of G-d’s name.

Boker Tov to all and Chag Sameach to the Jewish posters here.

The conservative mikvah is lovely. Carol is the most caring woman and makes every trip meaningful–which is what going to mikvah is really about anyway.

No, it’s not similar at all. Does the immersion of a Reform or Conservative Jew treyf the mikvah, the same way a ham sandwich would treyf a kosher kitchen?

In the Chicago area, most Reform do require mikvah immersion and the conversions are such that Conservative will accept. Many Reform women are beginning to add the mikvah (there is a Conservative one in the northern suburbs) to their practice.

Stay on topic. You brought up day schools, and I responded about day schools. Now you’re talking about the movement in general. I’m not in the mood to get into a larger discussion re. Conservative Judaism or re. your determiners of Jewish commitment (all of them Orthodox-based criteria, therefore syllogistic) b/c it’s nice outside and I wanna go to the gym and get BUFF. But as for day schools, a minority — the highly committed (and admittedly financially secure) minority — of Conservative Jews attend them. If day schools were somehow made universal, the Conservative movement would be in less difficult straits today. But day schools themselves — the institution you brought up — are largely a success.

United Synagogue of Conservative Judaism executive vice president Rabbi Jerome Epstein once publicly admitted that “many of the most committed products of our movement end up joining Orthodox synagogues.” Conservative in practice allows convenience and popular sentiment to trump the halachic standards it pays lip service to. Many committed to Conservative Jewish ideals can’t help but notice the difference between theory and the reality on the ground.

According to the 1990 National Jewish Population Survey, a mere 29% of Conservative Jews buy only kosher meat. Only 15% consider themselves Sabbath observant (even by Conservative standards). A 1996 JTS study noted that a majority of young Conservative-affiliated Jews polled said that it was “all right for Jews to marry people of other faiths.” Nearly three-quarters of Conservative Jews said that they consider a Jew to be anyone raised Jewish, even if his or her mother was a gentile—the official Reform position, rejected by Conservative leaders as nonhalachic. Only half of Conservative Bar and Bat Mitzvah receptions were kosher, by any standard. Add to that recent statistics that show a 38% intermarriage rate amongst Conservative Jews – and then tell me I am being unfair.

It’s not news that the Conservative movement is in trouble. Most of its harshest critics come from within their own ranks. There’s nothing new in anything I said.

I don’t hate schools. A good one is great. A home-schooling mentality can supplement a school. There are simply some people who just do not jolly well HAVE the money for certain kinds of schools and might HAVE to figure out a Plan B and it might not be so very terrible! Yes, it would take grit and consitency. Well, you are earning the un-spent tuition money. So sweat. Guidance is probably available. I mean, is it? Serious Jewish-content homeschooling materials?

You need a serious, scheduled day, and mutual enthusiasm between parent and kid.