There are plenty of non-Orthodox Israelis who are very devoted to the Jewish people – to the point of laying down their lives in our defence.

The point is how we are going to govern ourselves – how we are going to bridge the gaps between us, reach consensus, and insure a fair, equable, level playing ground in the public sphere.

The current system does not do this. The Supremes are part of the problem. And liberal-minded folks who support the Supremes must know at some level that they are compromising fundamentals of stable, equable democracy – largely, I think, because they sense that they can only get their way by fiat.

This is happening elsewhere in the world, too – having lost widespread support, lefties are barricading themselves into power bases that are resistant to public opinion such as the media, the courts, and academia.

Such people should not deliver righteous lectures about how they’re protecting democracy.

I think you really have to be living in Israel to understand this.

Gee – thanks for clearing that up, Muddle!

And to think that all these years I thought that the link between representation and legislation was central to democracy – and that powers of unelected folks was supposed to be limited precisely because they don’t draw their authority from the people.

But if you call them “judges” and roll your eyes self-righteously and ignore 60 years of one-sided judicial acitivism and wrap yourself in a distracting Holocaust-survivor flag and blather about the Ortho-Taliban…. well, then it’s all right….

after all, Muddle says so.

Do you even read this garbage after you’ve typed it?

We need a “strong judiciary” to…. protect us from…. our elected representatives?

And a constitution would…. get in the way of…. this glorious oligarchy?

Hello?

Ben David, your address of my comments was actually in favor of what I wrote. I ask you to reread comment #4.

Also, read Josh’s comments and see that he is trying to bring in elements of a theocracy into the way Israel is run: “Oh, as for the Israeli ‘constitution’. Well, on one hand, we don’t have one, on the other hand, we do, and it’s called the Torah.”

Should I be worried about an “Ortho-Taliban?” Not exactly, because extremist Jews are very different than extremist Muslims, but should I be worried about theocratic ambitions in Israel? Yes. Josh extinguishes your point because Josh is a reasonable guy from the religious Right.

If Friedman would have had the decency to seek out these serious and extreme changes to Israel’s judiciary after running some discussion panels, asking for public and political input, speaking to justices in formal settings, including justices in the decision-making process and treating the Supreme Court with respect, then we would have a transparent process here. Then, we would all know what he’s up to and why. Then, Israelis would have influence on their own future and knowledgeable people such as Israel’s judges would have had a say in these wholesale changes. We would then enjoy the fruits of watching how a country and its institutions can contribute to critical changes in the manner in which the rights of its citizens are changed.

Finally, by giving the Ultra-Orthodox two situations where they received the upper hand, without showing the same respect to other groups, Friedman showed everybody one of two things. Either he is naive about the importance of his actions, or he is willfully absent of consideration for the civil rights of the majority of Israelis who don’t wish to live under ultra-Orthodox chumra. Whether it is the former or the latter, it is clear that he isn’t qualified to be making solo decisions about the fate of Israel’s judiciary.

If the Knesset genuinely believed that Barak’s constitutional revolution was invalid, it would pass the laws and force the court to strike them down. The fact that it doesn’t seems to indicate a preference for shirking difficult choices regarding the competing claims of the majority preferences and individual rights present in every liberal democracy.

The Beinishes and Baraks of Israel may be pushing opinions that you agree with – but they are doing so in a way that undermines the foundations of Israeli democracy.

And this makes their – and your – self-righteous rhetoric about defending Israeli democracty against some imaginary Ortho-Taliban false.

For those of us living with the fallout of the trashing of Israeli democracy – it is not just false, but unjust and evil.

Do what you like. It doesn’t change the facts, Friedman’s unfortunate actions, the reality that he has conceded to the demands of the Ultra-Orthodox to the degree that even the Modern Orthodox are complaining, and that if the judiciary is weakened, you, as a citizen of that state will suffer.

Enjoy.

The man made a mistake, he apologized, let him disappear somewhere out of the public eye. I don’t care if the Haredi guy called him a Nazi, insulted his penis, or said something about his mother. It does not matter one bit. There is no excuse and what is more pathetic is the media trying to get the public to give some compassion points for the alleged pain and suffering that this guy went through instead of condemning violence.

But we already know that the Israeli mass-media only cares about violence against ‘center-left’ Gush Dan people.

It is clear that if the Orthodox dont have control then the Reform and Conservative and other false religions trying to pawn themselves as Judaism will gain power and the nation will be a complete disastor. Keep the false forms out of Israel and keep in the US where it belongs.

We abandoned him

By Shahar Ilan

They don’t understand that barring entry to an honest man like Hartog is an insult to the Knesset, not to Hartog. Many of us are responsible for the fact that he broke down, and we will all pay the price for the slap on the face.

No profound understanding of human nature is necessary to understand that the slap delivered by Amnon De Hartog – the Justice Ministry official who approves support for public institutions – to MK Yakov Cohen reflected serious distress. For 15 years Hartog has guarded the public coffers and has fought our battles. And when last year he endured an unremitting offensive led by MK Moshe Gafni of United Torah Judaism, he remained alone. Hartog is a very gentle man. When he slapped Cohen on the face he found an unacceptable – and for him very uncharacteristic – way of making clear that this nightmare cannot continue.

The Knesset presidency barred Hartog from entering the building for the rest of his life. The truth is that had this punishment been imposed a day earlier, he would have considered it a prize. In recent months, his every visit to the Knesset could turn into a nightmare. Every time he appeared before a committee he could expect attacks by ultra-Orthodox MKs, and particularly Gafni. Gafni did not hesitate to insult him and accuse him of working for the benefit of national religious education, because his children study there.

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Many people in the Knesset thought it was a scandal, but nobody did anything about it, especially not the heads of the committees that were supposed to restrain Gafni. Hartog’s big mistake was that he did not refuse to come to the Knesset. The Ethics Committee discussed the subject last Monday, and like a trade union that protects its members, it didn’t even reprimand Gafni. What they don’t understand in the Knesset is that barring entry to an honest man like Hartog is an insult to the Knesset, not to Hartog.

The ultra-Orthodox press conducted a propaganda campaign against Hartog, and published pictures of him repeatedly. Hartog, a very religious man, lives in a mixed neighborhood with both Orthodox and ultra-Orthodox residents. There were synagogues in the neighborhood where they refused to pray with him. And let it be clear: When Hartog fought against ultra-Orthodox institutions, he did so from a halakhic standpoint, which found it incomprehensible that religious people could steal and receive money fraudulently.

It is not unusual that the ultra- Orthodox use Holocaust-related terms when attacking someone they see as their enemy. For Hartog these attacks hit a sensitive nerve. His father, a Holocaust survivor, died a few months ago. He didn’t understand how one could say such things about someone whose parents survived the Holocaust. Every noble act by Hartog was interpreted negatively by the ultra-Orthodox. Two years ago he fought to have children in a Hadera ultra-Orthodox school removed from a building next to a high-tension wire. The ultra-Orthodox depicted this as a war against ultra- Orthodox education.

There are people who can say they sounded a warning. Haaretz reporter Yuval Yoaz, for example, published an article about Justice Minister Daniel Friedmann, who abandoned Hartog. And an attorney, Rabbi Gilad Kariv, filed a complaint to the Ethics Committee against Gafni. But what about the approximately 100 MKs who are not ultra-Orthodox, many of whom witnessed the attack and remained silent? What about the attorney general’s staff, who did not understand that in the end Hartog would break down? What about the organizations fighting for good government, which did not come to his defense? What about the rest of the press, which did not fulfill its role in defending the man who safeguarded the money that belongs to all of us? What about me, who was the person most familiar with Hartog’s work, and still did not think to sound a warning?

Many of us are responsible for the fact that Amnon De Hartog broke down, and we will all pay the price for the slap on the face; both with the money that will now flow without interference to non-government organizations that should not receive it, and with a marked increase in the level of corruption. Some people are irreplaceable. Hartog is one of them.

haaretz.com/ha...

Here is Ha’aretz.

For United Torah Judaism, the shock of the incident had a silver lining:- the removal from the Knesset of Hartog, who has long been tagged as the ultra-Orthodox’s Public Enemy No. 1.

Yesterday’s incident was the climax of a long-running, overt conflict between them and the person responsible for approving the criteria for budget allocations. When Hartog raised his hand against Cohen, it left UTJ with the upper hand.

“Hartog attempted to expel the Haredim from Israeli society as if we were Darfur refugees, to keep us from receiving the bare minimum. The slap demonstrates the hate he has accumulated, merely because we tell him to his face what we think about his tricky tactics,” MK Avraham Ravitz (UTJ) said.

“The master doesn’t like it when the Jewboy tells him to his face what he thinks about him.”

Dehartuch appeared on television Tuesday night and apologized for the “injury he caused to the dignity of MK Ya’acov Cohen and the dignity of the Knesset.” He also said that at his own request, he had asked the Justice Ministry for a leave of absence.

Dehartuch said no public figure had the right to describe anyone, including a civil servant, as being “worse than the Germans.”

“I try to do my work as well as I can, every day and all day,” he added, in response to the attacks against him. He specifically mentioned the haredi press and said it had vilified him for many years, calling him “an idiot, Haman and Antiochus.”

Interviewed on Channel 10 Tuesday night, Dehartuch apologized for the slap. “I’m sorry I lost control,” he said.

He said the comparison with Germans particularly angered him. “Comments like that must not be ignored,” he said. Dehartuch said the remark had been extremely insensitive.

“My father, who died last year, hid from the Nazis in Holland and 20 members of his family were wiped out,” he said.

While Knesset members were shocked to learn Dehartuch had physically assaulted an MK, many defended him as a hard working government official.

“Dehartuch is a serious man, an honest and ideological man who is an example and a symbol of striving toward a government free of corruption,” MK Zvi Hendel (NU-NRP) said. “Not many could restrain themselves from slapping, if Amnon indeed chose to do so to MK Cohen. I suggest we all take a deep breath and refrain from speaking harshly of him.”

Meretz chairman Yossi Beilin said haredi politicians had treated Dehartuch “in an unbearable manner” over the past few years. “Firing him would be a dream come true for the haredim,” he said.

There is a very friggin simple rule we go by in the 21st century western world and I’m sure you’ve heard about it: sticks and stones… but names…

There is absolutely no excuse, and absolutely no context needed to explain why some assumed mature and respected civil servant can hit an elected member of knesset.

There is no doubt that if the roles would be reversed, you’d be crying for the puncher to be sent to jail and key thrown away.

The slap was inexcusable and deserved punishment, but a lifetime ban? And the people who brought it about walk away laughting about the victory? Where was the Minister after the slap to assess what had happened and make moves to protect his employee? Where was the Minister to ensure that future representatives from his Ministry will be treated differently? Where was the Minister to speak out in public view about the reprehensible behavior of the people who brought about this outcome? I’ll tell you where he was. In bed with them. He was negotiating a “blacklist” with Amar right after having appointed 12 out 15 Ultra-Orthodox to the Rabbinic court after 4 years of a stalemate.

(also, keep in mind that the lawyer in question called the mk a beast before the nazi comment was made…)

Besides that, the upper court regularly rules whether laws are ‘constitutional’ or not based on their interpretation of the unexisting Israeli constitution.

What kind of democarcy allows an ‘independant’ body to control it? And middle, what is wrong with ‘increasing the powers of politicians over the justices.”

Middle, the most dangerous tool that the Israeli court system has adopted is the power to cancel laws. A majority of knesset members can pass a law, but someone can then take that law to court and get it cancelled. That is absurd and it nullifies the purpose of the knesset. It is even widely known that some ideas for laws are not even propsoed because they ‘won’t pass the higher court’!?

The credibility of the court system is at an all time low. The court system itself blames that situation on everyone but itself. I don’t want to live in a democracy like that. I want this oligarchic court system cleaned out properly. Friedman is the ultimate minister that we dream of – professional and unpolitical.

Middle, you should actually be proud that this is happening. Should judges choose their replacements or should third-party committes? Should Beinisch be a judge playing dirty politics through the Israeli tabloids?

It’s time for a cleaning. Please research properly before the knee-jerk siding with one side.

Shavuah tov!!!