Massive intelligence failure by Israel. They sent their soldiers into a battle unwittingly and unprepared.
6/2/2010 at 5:14 am
are you sure that video is authentic? It doesn’t really *show* anything, and easily could have been staged and recorded in the past 24 hours.
6/2/2010 at 12:32 pm
To all those who don’t believe the video is authentic, I guess you’re right that it doesn’t show much of anything. However, the voices sound pretty real.
6/2/2010 at 5:56 am
This video shows nothing. You can see nothing and all you can hear is a man screaming about weapons. The official IDF video evidence shows that the weapons found on board the ship were a slingshot, a metal pipe and a bag of marbles – the IDF responded to this with firearms killing at least a dozen people. There is no defence you can give of this attack. The only rebuttal ever given by Israel supporters is that opponents are anti-semite, which shows the extent of Zionist hypocrisy since Palestinians are starved and pillaged daily for being Palestinians.
6/2/2010 at 6:54 am
Lame video. Should not really be posted – even at the end, he says a word that would indicate it is not confirmable that it is live ammo.
6/2/2010 at 7:59 am
TM, seems to me, by your standards they’re doomed and to blame either way. In one post you rail that they should have never boarded tha ship, an then in this one, since they boarded the ship they should have been Bette equiped. Am I supposed to believe that if they boarded the ship the way they should have, with live ammo and shooting to kill, that you wouldn’t write a post about how they were too aggressive? Somehow I think you’d find something to complain about. It’s readily apparent that in these situations, there is no winning tactic for Israel. The government knows this. The military knows this. Yet try decided to protect their national sovereignty and prevented a break of the blockade. No matter what, the world, and the assorted antiSemites (who claim they’re not!), would still chime in with the usual mantra that Jews must not defend themselves nor their nation and borders, so what I keep wondering, is why you, a self proclaimed defender of Israel has to pile on and provide ammo to the haters?
So if this is one of those obligatory posts that show that proIsrael Jews can be critical of Israel, can you maybe start providing disclaimers so some of us don’t have to bother?
6/2/2010 at 12:28 pm
Alex, it seems to me that you need to insert a new word into your vocabulary: nuance.
I can consider the government stupid for taking this action, and I can consider this to be an intelligence failure and yet I can still be cognizant of the fact that this was a propaganda flotilla with people aboard who wished to kill Jews. I can still support the commandos who went aboard endangering themselves by suiting up with paintball guns instead of real guns. I can support a desire to have a blockade from the ocean while thinking that there are other ways to confront a flotilla such as this. I can support a blockade because Israel believes it’s the best way to control the potential violence, while rejecting elements of the blockade. I can support the blockade while believing that it’s detrimental to Israel’s cause.
You see, Alex, these are complex matters. They are not black and white and they are not right or left.
6/2/2010 at 8:24 am
are you sober alex? dont think so. also, i am very tired of reading anti-semitism phrases every time anyone criticizes anything the state does. it is getting ridiculous.
the video could be authentic or could be not. if it is authentic, what exactly does it prove? we dont know the context, i.e. when, where, who, what, why, how etc…
6/2/2010 at 8:51 am
Wtf, I really could care less that you’re tired. Boo hoo.
6/2/2010 at 8:59 am
couldnt care less is what you wanted to say alex? if so, that might be because you are ignorant – the lazy way.
6/2/2010 at 9:06 am
I hope this isn’t faked. Not because it’s valuable – it isn’t, it’s too low quality to be of any use – but because if it’s proved to be fake it discredits the Israeli case. Right now, it seems obvious that the flotilla is in the wrong and deliberately provoked Israel by failing to accept their entirely reasonable invitation to dock so that the cargo could be inspected – Israel isn’t always perfect and some of the Israeli government and IDF’s actions in the past have been questionable, but all the evidence in this case points to them being above blame this time.
6/2/2010 at 1:09 pm
Yeah. I remember nuance became a phrase of the year during Obama’s election. “My pastor isn’t really an anti-Semite, he just hates money people and zionists.” Thats your nuance. You can keep it.
6/2/2010 at 1:24 pm
You see, Alex, you do understand nuance! I’m so proud of you. Now do try to follow along as I provide you with posts offering a little more complexity than we tend to find in your comments…
6/2/2010 at 2:06 pm
TM, try not to hurt yourself while offering a little more complexity and nuance when you write a post about Barney Franks’ despicable, yet nuanced comments today:
“U.S. Rep. Barney Frank had harsh words yesterday for the Israeli Navy after a bloody raid on a pro-Palestinian flotilla outside of Gaza, describing nine activists killed in the conflict as “innocent” and calling for an independent inquiry into the showdown.
Frank, in a wide-ranging interview with the Herald, went on to say that “as a Jew,” Israeli treatment of Arabs around some of the West Bank settlements “makes me ashamed that there would be Jews that would engage in that kind of victimization of a minority.””
Like I said, with friends like these….
6/2/2010 at 2:29 pm
Alex, with all due respect, if you want apologia for what politicians say, go speak to those politicians. Would you like me to bring up things that James Baker or James Jones have said?
6/2/2010 at 2:35 pm
Actually, I’ve just listened to the youtube video and I don’t think he says anything that’s too harsh. He actually seems to be relatively evenhanded.
6/2/2010 at 2:53 pm
First of all, James Baker nor James Jones are Jewish and we’re on Jewlicious here, are we not? I’m not asking you to apologize for him. I just think its a very Jewliciousy subject: the consistent leftist American Jews stabbing Israel in the back.
And really? How many posts have you made thus far regarding this incident and the supposed “innocents” on that boat. Barney says the exact opposite of what you are saying: that they were innocent (according to the reporter from the Boston Herald). Furthermore, he states that it “makes me ashamed that there would be Jews that would engage in that kind of victimization of a minority.”. He’s talking about the Israeli government. Are you ashamed, “as a Jew” and agree with him?
Sure, he said the part about the sinking of the South Korean ship and he’s right. But so is a broken clock…
6/2/2010 at 3:00 pm
You, Alex, remind me of a broken clock.
6/2/2010 at 3:09 pm
Thanks. I’ll take it there was some nuance to that statement.
6/4/2010 at 2:03 pm
The rest of the footage was uninteresting as it only contained shots of American Furkan Dogan being shot in the head four times. Therefore, it has been deleted.
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